Raglan Sleeves with Rotate and Union tools

tshirt
raglan
rotate
uniontool
movetool

#1

This thread continues a discussion from the Issues list. @Timo_Virtaneva asked for a tool to move Draw mode pattern pieces together to create a Raglan sleeved pattern. Unfortunately this tool isn’t possible, as points from different pattern pieces in Draw mode can’t be joined. But there is a more accurate way to create a Raglan sleeved pattern than placing pattern pieces together and drawing lines between them. This method needs less manual correction at the final fitting stage and will morph correctly when measurements are changed.


Here is my method of creating Raglan Sleeves without moving and rotating pattern pieces. The front raglan seamline has some curve, the back raglan seamline is straight.


The sleeve was created with an extra point in the front armscye and back armscye to enable joining the front and back shoulder pieces with the sleeve.


The details were generated with a split sleeve. The front sleeve was joined to the front shoulder, same for the back sleeve joined to the back shoulder. Then the front combined sleeve was joined to the back combined sleeve to make the raglan sleeve, then the seam allowance was added.


Puffed sleeves
#3

@slpencer, can you add that in this thread we continue our discussion? And briefly explain what is this all about. Most people don’t know why we have started this thread.


#4

To create the extra points on sleevecap:

  • Segment the armscye curve where you want the raglan shoulder to start (x1)
  • Create line or curve up to neckline (x2)
  • Add a Line from the shoulder tip to the new point on the armscye ( Line_p11_x1)

On your sleeve pattern, define the top section to join with the bodice:

  • Create an arc on the front sleevecap with radius = Line_p11_x1. Select any angles which will surround the sleevecap curve. (Center=B, Length=Line_p11_x1, Angle1=180, Angle2=270) Arc tool
  • Create the point x3 with the Intersect Curves tool. Select the front sleevecap curve and the new arc) (Curve1=Spl_p16_B, Curve2=Arc_B_426)
    Point Intersect Curves tool
  • Repeat these two steps for the back sleevecap using the line from back armscye and the back sleevecap curve

#5

My point for starting this conversation is find a solution to create pattern piece, which has parts of other pattern pieces. The example is raglan sleeve.

The first method is to create front and back panel of the shirt with raglan sleeve markings. When creating the sleeve, try to draw the same lines and curves to the sleeve shoulder.

The second way is to create the normal shirt with sleeve. Then marking the raglan sleeve on back and front panels and copying those parts and attaching those to the sleeve. Similar to the way of working with paper patterns. Currently this method is not possible, because the copied part can not be attached to another pattern.

This first way is clear and straight forward. The raglan seam is limited to to the recreation to the sleeve head.

The second way can be added to any already made pattern. There is no limitation to shape of the raglan sleeve. Here is an example of the seam

As i mentioned the raglan sleeve is just on example of this kind of pattern manipulation. The are many more cases for this kind of cut-and-paste type of operation.

The problem is here, but what is the solution.


#6

This is impossible. Each pattern piece independent and share only data not objects with next pattern pieces. If you need link them this mean you have one pattern piece not two.

But, with tool Move you could make two piece inside of one pattern piece.

Why you can’t first copy and then add a sleeve to it?


#7

It is OK to have all in one piece. The challenge is to link the moved part to another part with common point.

To avoid drawing the whole pattern from beginning I have the basic pattern ready. I make a copy of it and do the modification to it. In this raglan sleeve case I have the shirt ready with separate sleeve.


#8

@Stinde, i have filling we are speaking about different things. Can you provide me an image? I want to be sure i see what you see.


#9

I sent by email one example


#10

Let’s look at your example.

Here you want connect points A4 and Aa2(original A). Because you work in the same pattern piece you can do it even now. First of all when you move curve A_A3 select A as base point. Also you need to create a line A_A4. And probably make it invisible. This will give you enough data to connect in exact correct position. You will have A_A4 length and an angle.

Am i right?


#11

Great. It works. Thanks

This is real hacking. Squeezing everything out of it.

This solves the problem and it can be done.


#12

This also shows that your base idea was right. I will add new tool Move variant.


#13

Excellent. Thanks. Again I learned new ways of using Valentina


#14

Not only you.:slight_smile:

I think step by step we make it very flexible.


#16

I have to say, that I’d really like to follow this discussion, but I absolutely don’t understand what you are doing here, which tools you are using and why and how. Would it be possible to create a somewhat more in-depth description, starting from a normal shirt pattern transforming it into a raglan pattern the way you did?

@dismine somehow, this reminds me of issue #585 :wink:


#17

ok, but it could take some time.


#18

Don’t think so.:slight_smile:


#19

Okay, more or less I got the concept, however some more detailed instruction would be helpful. For example, the Union tool works strange sometimes for me. It says that select some “point on edge” which is completely unknown for me, what could be that “point on edge”? It asks sometimes but not every time and sometimes both detail are affected with this demand, sometimes just one of them.

Secondly, this method if I understand and see correctly, results in a raglan sleeve with a dart at the top of the sleeve pattern (which is an opened shoulder seam). But what is the correct method to create a raglan sleeve piece without this dart or opened shoulder seam? The old “put together the front and back panel then align the sleeve pattern on it and draft the new raglan seams” can produce this “closed shoulder seam”-type of raglan sleeve, however, the method is not as precise mathematically as Valentina calculates and cannot be performed with Valentina as those is another approach (using paper pieces to manipulate physically the pattern itself) So I am searching for some method in Valentina to move/attach/unite those removed pieces from the back and front panel to the sleeve piece to create a raglan sleeve without that dart/shoulder seam. Is it possible? Or am I using the Union tool in a wrong way?


#20

First question. Which version do you use?


#21

The latest beta build (0.5.00) created on April 10.


#22

The split sleeve was my design choice. The bicep line is tight and the sleevecap is high, like a fitted tshirt for women. The sleeve hangs close to the side of the tshirt, and this seam looks good to me, it suits my design needs.

To design the sleeves that you want: Widen the bicep line a bit by adding ease to the arm_upper_circ in the formula. See how the the sleevecap shortens. Join the shoulder pieces so that there is no seam line. Join the sleeves together. Join the shoulder section & sleeve sections together to make the whole sleeve.